Discussion:
PIR interfering with wireless network
(too old to reply)
Peter Hucker
2009-01-30 18:20:10 UTC
Permalink
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10 cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets. PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with wireless networking?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

If you're cross-eyed and have dyslexia, can you read all right?
John Fields
2009-01-30 20:18:14 UTC
Permalink
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 18:20:10 -0000, "Peter Hucker" <***@spam.com>
wrote:

We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?

---
If its PIR it shouln't.

PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.

http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF

Maybe the wiring is affecting the strength of the RF field areound where
she sits.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-01-30 20:44:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?
---
If its PIR it shouln't.
PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.
http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
Post by Peter Hucker
Maybe the wiring is affecting the strength of the RF field areound where
she sits.
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?

The effect is as such: within about 2-3 metres the network is unusable. The next 2-3 metres it works most of the time. After that it's almost perfect.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Financial Retirement Plan:
If you had purchased $1000.00 of Nortel stock one year ago, it would now be worth $49.00.
With Enron, you would have had $16.50 left of the original $1,000.00.
With WorldCom, you would have had less than $5.00 left.
But, if you had purchased $1,000.00 worth of Beer one year ago, drank all the beer, then turned in the cans for the aluminium recycling refund, you would have had $214.00.
Based on the above, current investment advice is to drink heavily and recycle.
John Fields
2009-01-31 15:07:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?
---
If its PIR it shouln't.
PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.
http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
---
Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by Peter Hucker
Maybe the wiring is affecting the strength of the RF field areound where
she sits.
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?
---
I didn't say the wiring was responsible for generating the field, I said
it might have an _effect_ on the [already existing] field.

JF
ABLE1
2009-01-31 16:56:24 UTC
Permalink
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)

A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.

A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor. The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if the return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or outside the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature change that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm. This is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.

All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the detector is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel and see
what happens.

My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same time of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.

1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the range in
this area was modified.

2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.

3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.

4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.

5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that cannot be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!

5) All of the above.

6) Other

I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.

Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.

Good luck and have a nice day.

Les
Post by John Fields
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:18:14 -0000, John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?
---
If its PIR it shouln't.
PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.
http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
---
Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Maybe the wiring is affecting the strength of the RF field areound where
she sits.
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?
---
I didn't say the wiring was responsible for generating the field, I said
it might have an _effect_ on the [already existing] field.
JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-02 21:18:01 UTC
Permalink
I covered it with a biscuit tin lid today, and the problem immediately vanished. I happend to spot a workman installing more of them and told him to remove it. He said therew as absolutely no way it could be causing that problem, but I persuaded him to remove it while a continuous ping was on the screen of a wireless laptop. It could clearly be seen that as soon as he unplugged it, everything worked, and when he put it back, packets disappeared. He told me it used microwaves, but couldn't tell me the frequency (although he thought it was meant to be substantially higher than 2.4GHz). All of the detectors throughout the building look identical, but only this one appeared to cause problems. Perhaps it was faulty and was oscillating at half the correct frequency?

The whole of the new corridor still hates higher numbered channels for no apparent reason. Channel 1 works perfectly, channel 6 works with older laptops but not new ones(?!) and channel 11 works with nothing. There is only that one transmitter in range there, so who knows what's going on!
Post by ABLE1
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)
A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.
A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor. The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if the return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or outside the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature change that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm. This is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.
All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the detector is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel and see
what happens.
My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same time of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.
1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the range in
this area was modified.
2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.
3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.
4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.
5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that cannot be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!
5) All of the above.
6) Other
I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.
Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.
Good luck and have a nice day.
Les
Post by John Fields
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:18:14 -0000, John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?
---
If its PIR it shouln't.
PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.
http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
---
Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Maybe the wiring is affecting the strength of the RF field areound where
she sits.
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?
---
I didn't say the wiring was responsible for generating the field, I said
it might have an _effect_ on the [already existing] field.
JF
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

What comes after 69?
Mouthwash.
ABLE1
2009-02-03 21:41:59 UTC
Permalink
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.

It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.

Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.

Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.

Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.

On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London. Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.

I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.

Good luck.

Les
Post by Peter Hucker
I covered it with a biscuit tin lid today, and the problem immediately
vanished. I happend to spot a workman installing more of them and told him
to remove it. He said therew as absolutely no way it could be causing that
problem, but I persuaded him to remove it while a continuous ping was on
the screen of a wireless laptop. It could clearly be seen that as soon as
he unplugged it, everything worked, and when he put it back, packets
disappeared. He told me it used microwaves, but couldn't tell me the
frequency (although he thought it was meant to be substantially higher than
2.4GHz). All of the detectors throughout the building look identical, but
only this one appeared to cause problems. Perhaps it was faulty and was
oscillating at half the correct frequency?
The whole of the new corridor still hates higher numbered channels for no
apparent reason. Channel 1 works perfectly, channel 6 works with older
laptops but not new ones(?!) and channel 11 works with nothing. There is
only that one transmitter in range there, so who knows what's going on!
Post by ABLE1
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)
A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.
A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor.
The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if the return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or outside the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature change that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm. This is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.
All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the detector is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel and see
what happens.
My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same time of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.
1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the range in
this area was modified.
2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.
3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.
4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.
5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that cannot be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!
5) All of the above.
6) Other
I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.
Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.
Good luck and have a nice day.
Les
Post by John Fields
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:18:14 -0000, John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?
---
If its PIR it shouln't.
PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.
http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
---
Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Maybe the wiring is affecting the strength of the RF field areound where
she sits.
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?
---
I didn't say the wiring was responsible for generating the field, I said
it might have an _effect_ on the [already existing] field.
JF
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
What comes after 69?
Mouthwash.
John Fields
2009-02-03 22:22:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London. Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
---
This is USENET, not email.

Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-06 19:37:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London. Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell. Email discussions often end with a few topics within them, then top posting just gets confusing.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

In the UK, 90% of things are prohibited. The other 10% are compulsory.
John Fields
2009-02-08 16:11:42 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.

This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.

JF
John Fields
2009-02-08 16:16:38 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 10:11:42 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
---
I almost forgot about this part:

"I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater."

So you support confusion for the sake of "neatness"?

JF
krw
2009-02-08 18:47:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 10:11:42 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
---
"I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater."
So you support confusion for the sake of "neatness"?
Of course that PHucker supports confusion, though there is no
"neatness" in unlimited line lengths. He basically doesn't care
what his readers have to go through. *He* is more impotent.
John Fields
2009-02-09 00:45:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by krw
Post by John Fields
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 10:11:42 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
---
"I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater."
So you support confusion for the sake of "neatness"?
Of course that PHucker supports confusion, though there is no
"neatness" in unlimited line lengths. He basically doesn't care
what his readers have to go through. *He* is more impotent.
---
Interestingly, reading his posts results in no "penalty" but, replying
to them does in that that invokes his unlimited line length message in
the "from" frame.

It's easy to fix by just mousing over to where you want the text to
break and clicking.

After that, the rest of the text shows up properly parsed, but without
the sequence indicator showing up.

It's easy enough to insert and fix up his post, but most of the time
it's "Why bother?"

JF
krw
2009-02-09 00:54:45 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 18:45:16 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by krw
Post by John Fields
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 10:11:42 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
---
"I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater."
So you support confusion for the sake of "neatness"?
Of course that PHucker supports confusion, though there is no
"neatness" in unlimited line lengths. He basically doesn't care
what his readers have to go through. *He* is more impotent.
---
Interestingly, reading his posts results in no "penalty" but, replying
to them does in that that invokes his unlimited line length message in
the "from" frame.
That depends on the newsreader and the way it's set up. In any case
*his* settings are wrong, though he insists on continuing, like a
spoiled child.
Post by John Fields
It's easy to fix by just mousing over to where you want the text to
break and clicking.
Easier to ignore his crap.
Post by John Fields
After that, the rest of the text shows up properly parsed, but without
the sequence indicator showing up.
It's easy enough to insert and fix up his post, but most of the time
it's "Why bother?"
Exactly. Why bother with those who don't care about standards or their
readers.
Peter Hucker
2009-02-09 21:14:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by krw
Post by John Fields
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 10:11:42 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
---
"I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater."
So you support confusion for the sake of "neatness"?
Of course that PHucker supports confusion, though there is no
"neatness" in unlimited line lengths. He basically doesn't care
what his readers have to go through. *He* is more impotent.
---
Interestingly, reading his posts results in no "penalty" but, replying
to them does in that that invokes his unlimited line length message in
the "from" frame.
It's easy to fix by just mousing over to where you want the text to
break and clicking.
After that, the rest of the text shows up properly parsed, but without
the sequence indicator showing up.
It's easy enough to insert and fix up his post, but most of the time
it's "Why bother?"
Why bother getting a news client that can word wrap when replying? I dunno, ask yourself.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Yesterday scientists in the USA revealed that beer contains small traces of female hormones.
To prove their theory they fed 100 men 12 pints of beer and observed that 100% of them started talking nonsense and couldn't drive.
John Fields
2009-02-10 18:48:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
It's easy enough to insert and fix up his post, but most of the time
it's "Why bother?"
Why bother getting a news client that can word wrap when replying? I dunno, ask yourself.
---
Since yours is the source of the problem, why not fix yours?

JF
krw
2009-02-10 19:24:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
It's easy enough to insert and fix up his post, but most of the time
it's "Why bother?"
Why bother getting a news client that can word wrap when replying? I dunno, ask yourself.
---
Since yours is the source of the problem, why not fix yours?
Because he's an arrogant Brit, like the Dumb Donkey.
Peter Hucker
2009-02-10 19:53:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
It's easy enough to insert and fix up his post, but most of the time
it's "Why bother?"
Why bother getting a news client that can word wrap when replying? I dunno, ask yourself.
---
Since yours is the source of the problem, why not fix yours?
What causes the problem is irrelevant. You may aswell say the invention of the motor vehicle cause Mr Bloggs to die yesterday, so let's all go sue Henry Ford.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

They say confuscious does his crosswords with a pen.
John Fields
2009-02-10 23:36:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
It's easy enough to insert and fix up his post, but most of the time
it's "Why bother?"
Why bother getting a news client that can word wrap when replying? I dunno, ask yourself.
---
Since yours is the source of the problem, why not fix yours?
What causes the problem is irrelevant.
---
You're the cause of the problem, so I'll concede the point and agree
with you.

What _isn't_ irrelevant is the problem itself and the inconvenience it
causes those who wish to reply to your posts.

_Not_ fixing it when, ostensibly, you could with a few key clicks is
raising pig-headedness to a new low and speaks volumes about your
character.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
You may aswell say the invention of the motor vehicle cause Mr Bloggs
to die yesterday, so let's all go sue Henry Ford.
---
That's not the same thing at all.

Mr. Ford's philosophy mandated that the mistakes he made be fixed as
they were found, in the field, while yours seems to be that your readers
are responsible for finding work-around solutions to your errors.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-11 20:36:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
It's easy enough to insert and fix up his post, but most of the time
it's "Why bother?"
Why bother getting a news client that can word wrap when replying? I dunno, ask yourself.
---
Since yours is the source of the problem, why not fix yours?
What causes the problem is irrelevant.
---
You're the cause of the problem, so I'll concede the point and agree
with you.
No, the people who can't interpret a non-carriage returned line are the problem.
Post by John Fields
What _isn't_ irrelevant is the problem itself and the inconvenience it
causes those who wish to reply to your posts.
They can get decent software.
Post by John Fields
_Not_ fixing it when, ostensibly, you could with a few key clicks is
raising pig-headedness to a new low and speaks volumes about your
character.
It wouldn't be "fixing" it, it would be "changing" it. I don't want narrow columns of text on my wide screen.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

____
_[]_/____\__n_
|_____.--.__()_|
|LI //# \\ |
| \\__// |
| '--' |
'--------------'
Peter Hucker
2009-02-09 21:14:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 10:11:42 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
---
"I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater."
So you support confusion for the sake of "neatness"?
Alternately posting top and bottom is more confusing than all at the top.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

"These stretch pants come with a warranty of one year or 500,000 calories... whichever comes first."
John Fields
2009-02-10 18:43:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 10:11:42 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
---
"I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater."
So you support confusion for the sake of "neatness"?
Alternately posting top and bottom is more confusing than all at the top.
---
Then fix the post by arranging it properly, reply to it either inline or
bottom, and ask that the recipient follow suit.

JF
krw
2009-02-10 19:23:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
On Sun, 08 Feb 2009 10:11:42 -0600, John Fields
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
---
"I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater."
So you support confusion for the sake of "neatness"?
Alternately posting top and bottom is more confusing than all at the top.
---
Then fix the post by arranging it properly, reply to it either inline or
bottom, and ask that the recipient follow suit.
I reply post-fix or preferably in-fix, then delete all the stuff
the OP munged. Hopefully they;ll get the message, though they're
usually a pig-headed self-important moron like the PHucker.
Peter Hucker
2009-02-09 21:13:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
No, in email you can end up discussing a few different things, 5 conversations at once. In-line posting is the only way this makes sense.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A New York man was forced to take a day off from work to
appear for a minor traffic summons. He grew increasingly
restless as he waited hour after endless hour for his case to be
heard.

When his name was called late in the afternoon, he stood
before the judge, only to hear that court would be adjourned for
the next day and he would have to return the next day.

"What for?" he snapped at the judge.

His honor, equally irked by a tedious day and sharp query
roared, "Twenty dollars contempt of court. That's why!"

Then, noticing the man checking his wallet, the judge relented.
"That's all right. You don't have to pay now."

The young man replied, "I'm just seeing if I have enough for two
more words."
John Fields
2009-02-10 18:41:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
No, in email you can end up discussing a few different things, 5 conversations at once. In-line posting is the only way this makes sense.
---
Perhaps, but that's beside the point, which is that top posting on
USENET is a bad thing.

The way to fix it is to arrange the ordering of the posts from top to
bottom, reply at the bottom (or inline, if required) and then ask that
the pattern be followed.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-10 18:47:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
This is USENET, not email.
Please bottom post or, when appropriate, inline post.
JF
Why do you say "not email"? It annoys me when people top post in email aswell.
Email discussions often end with a few topics within them,
then top posting just gets confusing.
---
'Email' as in private email when the communicators know what went before
seems to be the convention.
This isn't private email and, since the discussion can twist and turn in
time and readers can join the thread at any time, reducing the confusion
by in-line or bottom posting is a good thing.
No, in email you can end up discussing a few different things, 5 conversations at once. In-line posting is the only way this makes sense.
---
Perhaps, but that's beside the point, which is that top posting on
USENET is a bad thing.
The way to fix it is to arrange the ordering of the posts from top to
bottom, reply at the bottom (or inline, if required) and then ask that
the pattern be followed.
I agree with you that we should all post at the bottom. But I'm not going to take mny time to rearrange someone else's mistake. It's not THAT big a deal.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

!
M
/ \
{ }
{ }
{ }
# #
:_____:
|| ||
|!___!|
| ___ |
|/###\|
!{###}!
||###||
||!!!||
/111\/|!!!|\/111\
| !|@@@|! |
| !|@@@|! |
|---O-!\###/!-O---|
|_____! --- !_____|
{|-----! - !-----|}
q! ! ||| ! !p
( | |\ /| | )
/\ q | -- | |_| | -- | p /\
/ \ { | | } / \
| | : ( || | \ / | || ) : | |
| | : <\------- / W \ -------/> : | |
| |!!/ ! || /\ /\ || ! \!!| |
| _^^ ( || || || || ) ^^_ |
-</ \ || \\ // || / \>-
<// ! || \\ // || ! \\>
_-</||___-------| || \\ // || |-------___||\>-_
/ || \ || --- || / || \
o<|| ||______------|||___ ___|||------______|| ||>o
\ |__-- ____________/ ! ! \____________ --__| /
\ |____---| ! \ U / ! |---____| /
\| | _______ ! ! ! ! _______ | |/
\ _____---| |--=| | | |=--| |---_____ /
"" |\|----| |----|/| ""
/||! ! ! !||\
_/Y ||! ! ! !|| Y\_
__/ ||!____! !____!|| \__
/ ||||####||####||| \
| \| |||| |||| |/ |
| / ==== ==== \ |
\___---' \!!/ \!!/ '---___/
[$$$$] [$$$$]
#### ####
###### ######
###############
Peter Hucker
2009-02-04 20:50:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
I can't take credit for it. It was suggested in this thread (or in the same thread in some other groups).
Post by ABLE1
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
They replaced it with an identical model, and the problem went away. I suspected it might as they had put one in every office and only one office showed problems. The installer was bewildered and had never seen such a thing before.
Post by ABLE1
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London. Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
Post by Peter Hucker
I covered it with a biscuit tin lid today, and the problem immediately
vanished. I happend to spot a workman installing more of them and told him
to remove it. He said therew as absolutely no way it could be causing that
problem, but I persuaded him to remove it while a continuous ping was on
the screen of a wireless laptop. It could clearly be seen that as soon as
he unplugged it, everything worked, and when he put it back, packets
disappeared. He told me it used microwaves, but couldn't tell me the
frequency (although he thought it was meant to be substantially higher than
2.4GHz). All of the detectors throughout the building look identical, but
only this one appeared to cause problems. Perhaps it was faulty and was
oscillating at half the correct frequency?
The whole of the new corridor still hates higher numbered channels for no
apparent reason. Channel 1 works perfectly, channel 6 works with older
laptops but not new ones(?!) and channel 11 works with nothing. There is
only that one transmitter in range there, so who knows what's going on!
Post by ABLE1
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)
A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.
A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor.
The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if the return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or outside the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature change that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm. This is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.
All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the detector is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel and see
what happens.
My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same time of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.
1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the range in
this area was modified.
2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.
3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.
4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.
5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that cannot be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!
5) All of the above.
6) Other
I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.
Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.
Good luck and have a nice day.
Les
Post by John Fields
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:18:14 -0000, John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?
---
If its PIR it shouln't.
PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.
http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
---
Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Maybe the wiring is affecting the strength of the RF field areound where
she sits.
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?
---
I didn't say the wiring was responsible for generating the field, I said
it might have an _effect_ on the [already existing] field.
JF
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
What comes after 69?
Mouthwash.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns, you drive".
ABLE1
2009-02-05 13:17:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
I can't take credit for it. It was suggested in this thread (or in the
same thread in some other groups).
Post by ABLE1
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
They replaced it with an identical model, and the problem went away. I
suspected it might as they had put one in every office and only one office
showed problems. The installer was bewildered and had never seen such a
thing before.
Post by ABLE1
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London. Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
Post by Peter Hucker
I covered it with a biscuit tin lid today, and the problem immediately
vanished. I happend to spot a workman installing more of them and told him
to remove it. He said therew as absolutely no way it could be causing that
problem, but I persuaded him to remove it while a continuous ping was on
the screen of a wireless laptop. It could clearly be seen that as soon as
he unplugged it, everything worked, and when he put it back, packets
disappeared. He told me it used microwaves, but couldn't tell me the
frequency (although he thought it was meant to be substantially higher than
2.4GHz). All of the detectors throughout the building look identical, but
only this one appeared to cause problems. Perhaps it was faulty and was
oscillating at half the correct frequency?
The whole of the new corridor still hates higher numbered channels for no
apparent reason. Channel 1 works perfectly, channel 6 works with older
laptops but not new ones(?!) and channel 11 works with nothing. There is
only that one transmitter in range there, so who knows what's going on!
Post by ABLE1
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)
A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.
A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor.
The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if the return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or outside the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature change that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm. This is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.
All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the
detector
is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel
and
see
what happens.
My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same time of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.
1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the
range
in
this area was modified.
2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.
3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.
4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.
5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that cannot be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!
5) All of the above.
6) Other
I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.
Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.
Good luck and have a nice day.
Les
Post by John Fields
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:18:14 -0000, John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of
them
in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know,
as
I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped.
Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending
out
a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?
---
If its PIR it shouln't.
PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.
http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
---
Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Maybe the wiring is affecting the strength of the RF field areound where
she sits.
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?
---
I didn't say the wiring was responsible for generating the field, I said
it might have an _effect_ on the [already existing] field.
JF
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
What comes after 69?
Mouthwash.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns, you drive".
Good Show!!!
Peter Hucker
2009-02-05 20:00:54 UTC
Permalink
I cannot locate whsat you've written.
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
I can't take credit for it. It was suggested in this thread (or in the
same thread in some other groups).
Post by ABLE1
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
They replaced it with an identical model, and the problem went away. I
suspected it might as they had put one in every office and only one office
showed problems. The installer was bewildered and had never seen such a
thing before.
Post by ABLE1
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London. Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
Post by Peter Hucker
I covered it with a biscuit tin lid today, and the problem immediately
vanished. I happend to spot a workman installing more of them and told him
to remove it. He said therew as absolutely no way it could be causing that
problem, but I persuaded him to remove it while a continuous ping was on
the screen of a wireless laptop. It could clearly be seen that as soon as
he unplugged it, everything worked, and when he put it back, packets
disappeared. He told me it used microwaves, but couldn't tell me the
frequency (although he thought it was meant to be substantially higher than
2.4GHz). All of the detectors throughout the building look identical, but
only this one appeared to cause problems. Perhaps it was faulty and was
oscillating at half the correct frequency?
The whole of the new corridor still hates higher numbered channels for no
apparent reason. Channel 1 works perfectly, channel 6 works with older
laptops but not new ones(?!) and channel 11 works with nothing. There is
only that one transmitter in range there, so who knows what's going on!
Post by ABLE1
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)
A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.
A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor.
The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if the return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or outside the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature change that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm. This is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.
All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the
detector
is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel
and
see
what happens.
My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same time of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.
1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the
range
in
this area was modified.
2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.
3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.
4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.
5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that cannot be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!
5) All of the above.
6) Other
I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.
Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.
Good luck and have a nice day.
Les
Post by John Fields
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:18:14 -0000, John Fields
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
---
Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
---
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?
---
I didn't say the wiring was responsible for generating the field, I said
it might have an _effect_ on the [already existing] field.
JF
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
What comes after 69?
Mouthwash.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns, you drive".
Good Show!!!
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A woman walks into a drugstore and asks the pharmacist if he sells size extra large condoms.
He replies, "Yes we do. Would you like to buy some?"
She responds, "No, but do you mind if I wait around here until someone does?
ABLE1
2009-02-06 02:24:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
I cannot locate whsat you've written.
That is because I have followed USENET protocol and bottom posted as I
was instructed to do so in such a nice way. Have a good day.
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
I can't take credit for it. It was suggested in this thread (or in the
same thread in some other groups).
Post by ABLE1
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
They replaced it with an identical model, and the problem went away. I
suspected it might as they had put one in every office and only one office
showed problems. The installer was bewildered and had never seen such a
thing before.
Post by ABLE1
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London.
Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
Post by Peter Hucker
I covered it with a biscuit tin lid today, and the problem immediately
vanished. I happend to spot a workman installing more of them and told him
to remove it. He said therew as absolutely no way it could be causing that
problem, but I persuaded him to remove it while a continuous ping was on
the screen of a wireless laptop. It could clearly be seen that as soon as
he unplugged it, everything worked, and when he put it back, packets
disappeared. He told me it used microwaves, but couldn't tell me the
frequency (although he thought it was meant to be substantially higher than
2.4GHz). All of the detectors throughout the building look identical, but
only this one appeared to cause problems. Perhaps it was faulty and was
oscillating at half the correct frequency?
The whole of the new corridor still hates higher numbered channels for no
apparent reason. Channel 1 works perfectly, channel 6 works with older
laptops but not new ones(?!) and channel 11 works with nothing. There is
only that one transmitter in range there, so who knows what's going on!
Post by ABLE1
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)
A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.
A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor.
The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if the return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or outside the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature
change
that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm.
This
is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.
All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the
detector
is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel
and
see
what happens.
My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same
time
of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.
1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the
range
in
this area was modified.
2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.
3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.
4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.
5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that cannot be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!
5) All of the above.
6) Other
I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.
Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.
Good luck and have a nice day.
Les
Post by John Fields
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:18:14 -0000, John Fields
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
---
Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
---
The wiring? It shouldn't have that strong a field from its wiring surely?
---
I didn't say the wiring was responsible for generating the field, I said
it might have an _effect_ on the [already existing] field.
JF
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
What comes after 69?
Mouthwash.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns, you drive".
Good Show!!!
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
A woman walks into a drugstore and asks the pharmacist if he sells size
extra large condoms.
He replies, "Yes we do. Would you like to buy some?"
She responds, "No, but do you mind if I wait around here until someone does?
Peter Hucker
2009-02-06 19:27:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
I cannot locate whsat you've written.
That is because I have followed USENET protocol and bottom posted as I
was instructed to do so in such a nice way. Have a good day.
I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater.

I didn't see your reply as it was after my sig. You didn't follow the sig seperator snip guideline :-P
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
I can't take credit for it. It was suggested in this thread (or in the
same thread in some other groups).
Post by ABLE1
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
They replaced it with an identical model, and the problem went away. I
suspected it might as they had put one in every office and only one office
showed problems. The installer was bewildered and had never seen such a
thing before.
Post by ABLE1
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London.
Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
Post by Peter Hucker
I covered it with a biscuit tin lid today, and the problem immediately
vanished. I happend to spot a workman installing more of them and told him
to remove it. He said therew as absolutely no way it could be causing that
problem, but I persuaded him to remove it while a continuous ping was on
the screen of a wireless laptop. It could clearly be seen that as soon as
he unplugged it, everything worked, and when he put it back, packets
disappeared. He told me it used microwaves, but couldn't tell me the
frequency (although he thought it was meant to be substantially higher than
2.4GHz). All of the detectors throughout the building look identical, but
only this one appeared to cause problems. Perhaps it was faulty and was
oscillating at half the correct frequency?
The whole of the new corridor still hates higher numbered channels for no
apparent reason. Channel 1 works perfectly, channel 6 works with older
laptops but not new ones(?!) and channel 11 works with nothing. There is
only that one transmitter in range there, so who knows what's going on!
Post by ABLE1
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)
A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.
A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor.
The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if the return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or outside the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature
change
that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm.
This
is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.
All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the
detector
is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel
and
see
what happens.
My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same
time
of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.
1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the
range
in
this area was modified.
2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.
3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.
4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.
5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that cannot be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!
5) All of the above.
6) Other
I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.
Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.
Good luck and have a nice day.
Les
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
What comes after 69?
Mouthwash.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns, you drive".
Good Show!!!
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
A woman walks into a drugstore and asks the pharmacist if he sells size
extra large condoms.
He replies, "Yes we do. Would you like to buy some?"
She responds, "No, but do you mind if I wait around here until someone does?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Why is it that when you transport something by car, it's called a shipment, but when you transport something by ship, it's called cargo?
ABLE1
2009-02-07 02:25:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
I cannot locate whsat you've written.
That is because I have followed USENET protocol and bottom posted as I
was instructed to do so in such a nice way. Have a good day.
I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater.
I didn't see your reply as it was after my sig. You didn't follow the sig
seperator snip guideline :-P
Just breaking all the rules..................................... one at a
time ..........
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
I can't take credit for it. It was suggested in this thread (or in the
same thread in some other groups).
Post by ABLE1
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
They replaced it with an identical model, and the problem went away.
I
suspected it might as they had put one in every office and only one office
showed problems. The installer was bewildered and had never seen such a
thing before.
Post by ABLE1
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London.
Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
Post by Peter Hucker
I covered it with a biscuit tin lid today, and the problem immediately
vanished. I happend to spot a workman installing more of them and
told
him
to remove it. He said therew as absolutely no way it could be
causing
that
problem, but I persuaded him to remove it while a continuous ping was on
the screen of a wireless laptop. It could clearly be seen that as
soon
as
he unplugged it, everything worked, and when he put it back, packets
disappeared. He told me it used microwaves, but couldn't tell me the
frequency (although he thought it was meant to be substantially
higher
than
2.4GHz). All of the detectors throughout the building look
identical,
but
only this one appeared to cause problems. Perhaps it was faulty and was
oscillating at half the correct frequency?
The whole of the new corridor still hates higher numbered channels
for
no
apparent reason. Channel 1 works perfectly, channel 6 works with older
laptops but not new ones(?!) and channel 11 works with nothing.
There
is
only that one transmitter in range there, so who knows what's going on!
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 16:56:24 -0000, ABLE1
Post by ABLE1
Ok, I have been reading this thread with great amusement. :-)
A couple of things to clear up. A PIR motion detector is a Passive Infrared
detector that detects movement in a space based upon focused infrared
temperature changes thru a Fresnel Lens of an object in front of the
detector. It cannot detect thru walls or glass.
A "Dual-Tech" Motion Detector uses two(dual) technologies to detect motion
or movement in a space. It uses a PIR sensor and a Microwave sensor.
The
microwave sends out pulses of microwave energy into the space if
the
return
signals change due to a person/object moving in the space (or
outside
the
space because it can see thru walls) and there is a temperature
change
that
has been detected by the PIR at the same time there is an alarm.
This
is
less false alarm prone than the simple PIR.
All that being said the simple way to prove or disprove that the
detector
is
causing the problem is get the security tech to power down the panel
and
see
what happens.
My guess is that something else other than the detector is causing the
problem and it is just a coincidence that it happened at the same
time
of
the install. It would be my guess that one of the following is the cause.
1) The transceiver was moved from its original position and the
range
in
this area was modified.
2) Some metal object has been moved/placed at a point that is deflecting
the signal.
3) A fluorescent light bulb/ballast is failing and giving off massive
amount of RFI causing the interference.
4) Sun Spots are reaching a peak in your area.
5) The earth magnetic field has been modified in ways that
cannot
be
fully explained. i.e. Government Plot!!!
5) All of the above.
6) Other
I have used the KISS method in the above description to ease the pain.
Some error in wording may be found. Whoops!!! Sorry for any confusion.
Hope that helps you to find your problem. Wireless is never perfect.
Good luck and have a nice day.
Les
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
What comes after 69?
Mouthwash.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns, you drive".
Good Show!!!
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
A woman walks into a drugstore and asks the pharmacist if he sells size
extra large condoms.
He replies, "Yes we do. Would you like to buy some?"
She responds, "No, but do you mind if I wait around here until someone does?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Why is it that when you transport something by car, it's called a
shipment, but when you transport something by ship, it's called cargo?
Peter Hucker
2009-02-07 20:34:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
I cannot locate whsat you've written.
That is because I have followed USENET protocol and bottom posted as I
was instructed to do so in such a nice way. Have a good day.
I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater.
I didn't see your reply as it was after my sig. You didn't follow the sig
seperator snip guideline :-P
Just breaking all the rules..................................... one at a
time ..........
Why limit yourself?
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would have never
thought of that one.
I can't take credit for it. It was suggested in this thread (or in the
same thread in some other groups).
Post by ABLE1
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
They replaced it with an identical model, and the problem went away.
I
suspected it might as they had put one in every office and only one office
showed problems. The installer was bewildered and had never seen such a
thing before.
Post by ABLE1
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference for the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London.
Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns, you drive".
Good Show!!!
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
A woman walks into a drugstore and asks the pharmacist if he sells size
extra large condoms.
He replies, "Yes we do. Would you like to buy some?"
She responds, "No, but do you mind if I wait around here until someone does?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Why is it that when you transport something by car, it's called a
shipment, but when you transport something by ship, it's called cargo?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if she were a dustcart reversing.
ABLE1
2009-02-08 01:27:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
I cannot locate whsat you've written.
That is because I have followed USENET protocol and bottom posted as I
was instructed to do so in such a nice way. Have a good day.
I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater.
I didn't see your reply as it was after my sig. You didn't follow the sig
seperator snip guideline :-P
Just breaking all the rules..................................... one at a
time ..........
Making it last longer gives more satisfaction. So many rules too little
time.
Post by Peter Hucker
Why limit yourself?
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
On Tue, 03 Feb 2009 21:41:59 -0000, ABLE1
Post by ABLE1
Very interesting!!!! Golly good show on the biscuit tin. Would
have
never
thought of that one.
I can't take credit for it. It was suggested in this thread (or in the
same thread in some other groups).
Post by ABLE1
It would be interesting to do one or both of the following.
Replace the offensive unit first with another of the same model.
They replaced it with an identical model, and the problem went away.
I
suspected it might as they had put one in every office and only one office
showed problems. The installer was bewildered and had never seen
such
a
thing before.
Post by ABLE1
Replace the offensive unit with another manufactures dual tech model.
Do your same evaluation on each and see if there is a difference
for
the
better or for the worse. As a back up plan have someone authorize the
install a high end PIR only unit.
On a lighter note this could be the reason for the snow in London.
Some
days you just never know what is going to happen next.
I certainly hope that someone is not jerking a chain as it were.
Good luck.
Les
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns,
you
drive".
Good Show!!!
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
A woman walks into a drugstore and asks the pharmacist if he sells size
extra large condoms.
He replies, "Yes we do. Would you like to buy some?"
She responds, "No, but do you mind if I wait around here until someone does?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Why is it that when you transport something by car, it's called a
shipment, but when you transport something by ship, it's called cargo?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if
she were a dustcart reversing.
Peter Hucker
2009-02-08 14:35:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
I cannot locate whsat you've written.
That is because I have followed USENET protocol and bottom posted as I
was instructed to do so in such a nice way. Have a good day.
Replying in silly places won't work with me. Opera colour codes things.
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
I usually bottom post aswell, unless the thread has already been top
posted, in which case I continue at the top to make it neater.
I didn't see your reply as it was after my sig. You didn't follow the sig
seperator snip guideline :-P
Just breaking all the rules..................................... one at a
time ..........
Making it last longer gives more satisfaction. So many rules too little
time.
Post by Peter Hucker
Why limit yourself?
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by ABLE1
Good Show!!!
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
A woman walks into a drugstore and asks the pharmacist if he sells size
extra large condoms.
He replies, "Yes we do. Would you like to buy some?"
She responds, "No, but do you mind if I wait around here until someone does?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
Why is it that when you transport something by car, it's called a
shipment, but when you transport something by ship, it's called cargo?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com
http://www.petersphotos.com
He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if
she were a dustcart reversing.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Excuse me, are you reading that paper you're sitting on?
John Fields
2009-02-09 01:06:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if
she were a dustcart reversing.
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-09 21:19:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if
she were a dustcart reversing.
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

__,='`````'=/__
'// (o) \(o) \ `' _,-,
//| ,_) (`\ ,-'`_,-\
,-~~~\ `'===' /-, \==```` \__
/ `----' `\ \ \/
,-` , \ ,.-\ \
/ , \,-`\`_,-`\_,..--'\
,` ,/, ,>, ) \--`````\
( `\`---'` `-,-'`_,< \ \_,.--'`
`. `--. _,-'`_,-` | \
[`-.___ <`_,-'`------( /
(`` _,-\ \ --`````````|--`
Post by John Fields
-`_,-`\,-` , |
<`_,' , /\ /
` \/\,-/ `/ \/`\_/V\_/
( ._. ) ( .__. )
| | | |
\,---_| |_---./
ooOO(_) (_)OOoo
John Fields
2009-02-10 18:52:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if
she were a dustcart reversing.
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
Huh?


JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-10 19:53:30 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if
she were a dustcart reversing.
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
Huh?
I did not follow your response to my sig.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A nice, calm and respectable lady went into the pharmacy, right up to the pharmacist, looked straight into his eyes, and said, “I would like to buy some cyanide.”The pharmacist asked, “Why in the world do you need cyanide?”
The lady replied, “I need it to poison my husband.”
The pharmacists eyes got big and he exclaimed, “Lord have mercy!
I can’t give you cyanide to kill your husband! That’s against the law!
I’ll lose my license! They’ll throw both of us in jail! All kinds of bad things will happen. Absolutely not! You CANNOT have any cyanide!”
The lady reached into her purse and pulled out a picture of her husband in bed with the pharmacist’s wife.
The pharmacist looked at the picture and replied, “Well now. That’s different. You didn’t tell me you had a prescription.”
John Fields
2009-02-10 23:44:33 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
He was deeply in love. When she spoke, he thought he heard bells, as if
she were a dustcart reversing.
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
Huh?
I did not follow your response to my sig.
---
Really?

That's sad, but just like it's not your problem to set the line wrap
when you post, it's not my problem to learn you up.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-11 20:36:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
Huh?
I did not follow your response to my sig.
---
Really?
That's sad, but just like it's not your problem to set the line wrap
when you post, it's not my problem to learn you up.
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Microsoft: This company has performed an illegal operation and will be shut down.
krw
2009-02-11 21:39:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
Huh?
I did not follow your response to my sig.
---
Really?
That's sad, but just like it's not your problem to set the line wrap
when you post, it's not my problem to learn you up.
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
Kinda defeats the purpose of every replying to you.
John Fields
2009-02-12 14:39:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
Huh?
I did not follow your response to my sig.
---
Really?
That's sad, but just like it's not your problem to set the line wrap
when you post, it's not my problem to learn you up.
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
---
It wasn't a joke, it suited my purpose perfectly, and if you didn't
understand it, oh well...

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-12 18:56:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
Huh?
I did not follow your response to my sig.
---
Really?
That's sad, but just like it's not your problem to set the line wrap
when you post, it's not my problem to learn you up.
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
---
It wasn't a joke, it suited my purpose perfectly,
What you mean was it was a serious joke.
Post by John Fields
and if you didn't understand it, oh well...
Wasted exercise.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

After hearing a couple's complaints that their intimate life wasn't what it used to be, the sex counselor suggested they vary their position.
"For example," he suggested, "you might try the wheelbarrow. Lift her legs, penetrate, and off you go."
The eager husband was all for trying this new idea as soon as they got home.
"Well, OK," the hesitant wife agreed, "but on two conditions.
First if it hurts, you will stop right away, and second," she insisted, "You have to promise we won't go past my mother's."
krw
2009-02-12 19:54:57 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
leaving you alone again, naturally?
What?
Huh?
I did not follow your response to my sig.
---
Really?
That's sad, but just like it's not your problem to set the line wrap
when you post, it's not my problem to learn you up.
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
---
It wasn't a joke, it suited my purpose perfectly,
What you mean was it was a serious joke.
No, *you* are a serious joke; nothing funny about it.
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
and if you didn't understand it, oh well...
Wasted exercise.
Talking sense to one PHucker, certainly.
John Fields
2009-02-12 20:38:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
wrote:>>>
Post by Peter Hucker
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
---
It wasn't a joke, it suited my purpose perfectly,
What you mean was it was a serious joke.
---
What a pompous ass you are, telling me what I meant.
I meant exactly what I said, and if you can't cope with the fact that
your ignorance keeps you from understanding certain things, then oh
well, Boo-hoo-hoo.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
and if you didn't understand it, oh well...
Wasted exercise.
---
No, it wasn't since, your response and continued response to it paints a
more accurate picture of who you are.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-13 20:19:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
wrote:>>>
Post by Peter Hucker
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
---
It wasn't a joke, it suited my purpose perfectly,
What you mean was it was a serious joke.
---
What a pompous ass you are, telling me what I meant.
I meant exactly what I said, and if you can't cope with the fact that
your ignorance keeps you from understanding certain things, then oh
well, Boo-hoo-hoo.
What you did was to make a joke with no effect as I didn't understand it. Pointless. To insult someone they must know you are doing so.
Post by John Fields
---
Post by Peter Hucker
and if you didn't understand it, oh well...
Wasted exercise.
---
No, it wasn't since, your response and continued response to it paints a
more accurate picture of who you are.
What are you a fucking detective?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Scots are tightwads who are saving up to become Jewish.
John Fields
2009-02-13 23:49:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
wrote:>>>
Post by Peter Hucker
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
---
It wasn't a joke, it suited my purpose perfectly,
What you mean was it was a serious joke.
---
What a pompous ass you are, telling me what I meant.
I meant exactly what I said, and if you can't cope with the fact that
your ignorance keeps you from understanding certain things, then oh
well, Boo-hoo-hoo.
What you did was to make a joke with no effect as I didn't understand it.
---
If you didn't understand it, then what makes you think it was a joke?
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Pointless. To insult someone they must know you are doing so.
---
Nope.

When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.

Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
and if you didn't understand it, oh well...
Wasted exercise.
---
No, it wasn't since, your response and continued response to it paints a
more accurate picture of who you are.
What are you a fucking detective?
---
Just tryin' to get the facts, Ma'am.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-14 18:09:59 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
wrote:>>>
Post by Peter Hucker
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
---
It wasn't a joke, it suited my purpose perfectly,
What you mean was it was a serious joke.
---
What a pompous ass you are, telling me what I meant.
I meant exactly what I said, and if you can't cope with the fact that
your ignorance keeps you from understanding certain things, then oh
well, Boo-hoo-hoo.
What you did was to make a joke with no effect as I didn't understand it.
---
If you didn't understand it, then what makes you think it was a joke?
Nothing else would have fitted in there.
Post by John Fields
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Pointless. To insult someone they must know you are doing so.
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them. If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing. You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
Post by John Fields
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
and if you didn't understand it, oh well...
Wasted exercise.
---
No, it wasn't since, your response and continued response to it paints a
more accurate picture of who you are.
What are you a fucking detective?
---
Just tryin' to get the facts, Ma'am.
Get a life?
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Whatever hits the fan will not be evenly distributed.
John Fields
2009-02-16 21:20:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
wrote:>>>
Post by Peter Hucker
Posting a joke that the victim doesn't understand defeats the purpose.
---
It wasn't a joke, it suited my purpose perfectly,
What you mean was it was a serious joke.
---
What a pompous ass you are, telling me what I meant.
I meant exactly what I said, and if you can't cope with the fact that
your ignorance keeps you from understanding certain things, then oh
well, Boo-hoo-hoo.
What you did was to make a joke with no effect as I didn't understand it.
---
If you didn't understand it, then what makes you think it was a joke?
Nothing else would have fitted in there.
---
Rubbish.

It was an insult, regardless of your claim that it wasn't.

Whether it was jocular or not is immaterial since you didn't understand
it and can't, therefore, responded to whether there was humor in it or
not.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Pointless. To insult someone they must know you are doing so.
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them.
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing.
---
Sure I have.

What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.

So why do you keep responding?
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
and if you didn't understand it, oh well...
Wasted exercise.
---
No, it wasn't since, your response and continued response to it paints a
more accurate picture of who you are.
What are you a fucking detective?
---
Just tryin' to get the facts, Ma'am.
Get a life?
---

"Polly want a cracker?"

Trite, predictable, and ordinary.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-17 18:59:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Pointless. To insult someone they must know you are doing so.
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them.
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Like what?
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing.
---
Sure I have.
What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
What use is that?
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.
So why do you keep responding?
---
To prevent you getting the last wod and gloating about it.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by John Fields
and if you didn't understand it, oh well...
Wasted exercise.
---
No, it wasn't since, your response and continued response to it paints a
more accurate picture of who you are.
What are you a fucking detective?
---
Just tryin' to get the facts, Ma'am.
Get a life?
---
"Polly want a cracker?"
Trite, predictable, and ordinary.
Sorry, I've not enrolled in the troll school like yourself.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Q: If you have a mothball in one hand and another mothball in the other hand, what would you have?
A: The undivided attention of a very large moth!
John Fields
2009-02-18 23:09:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Pointless. To insult someone they must know you are doing so.
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them.
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Like what?
---
Like to put them in their place, for one.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing.
---
Sure I have.
What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
What use is that?
---
It's a weapon I can use against you in the future.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.
So why do you keep responding?
---
To prevent you getting the last wod and gloating about it.
---
So it's OK for you to have the last word, but not for me?
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
"Polly want a cracker?"
Trite, predictable, and ordinary.
Sorry, I've not enrolled in the troll school like yourself.
---
Bullshit.

You're just not that good at it and you hate it when you get caught
because you can't flame worth a shit either.

Go ahead and take the last word, Bozo, I'm sure all of USENET is
waiting, suspensefully, to hear what you've got to say...

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-19 19:37:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Pointless. To insult someone they must know you are doing so.
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them.
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Like what?
---
Like to put them in their place, for one.
---
If I don't understand the insult, you haven't placed me anywhere.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing.
---
Sure I have.
What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
What use is that?
---
It's a weapon I can use against you in the future.
---
Admittance of trolling noted.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.
So why do you keep responding?
---
To prevent you getting the last wod and gloating about it.
---
So it's OK for you to have the last word, but not for me?
---
Of course.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
"Polly want a cracker?"
Trite, predictable, and ordinary.
Sorry, I've not enrolled in the troll school like yourself.
---
Bullshit.
You're just not that good at it and you hate it when you get caught
because you can't flame worth a shit either.
So you do admit to trolling.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A man in a hot air balloon  realized he was lost. He reduced altitude and spotted a woman below. He  descended a bit more and shouted, "Excuse me, can you help me? I promised a  friend I would meet him an hour ago, but I don't know where I am."
The woman below replied, "You're in a hot air balloon hovering approximately 30 feet above the ground. You're between 40 and 41 degrees north latitude and between 59 and 60 degrees west longitude."
"You must be an engineer," said the balloonist. "I am," replied the woman, "How did you know?"
"Well," answered the balloonist, "everything you told me is, technically correct, but I've no idea what to make of your information, and the fact is I'm  still lost. Frankly, you've not been much help at all. If anything, you've  delayed my trip."
The woman below responded, "You must be in Management."
"I am," replied the balloonist, "but how did you know?"
"Well," said the woman, "You don't know where you are or where you're going. You've risen to where you are due to a large quantity of hot air. You made a promise which you've no idea how to keep, and you expect people beneath you to solve your problems. The fact is you are in exactly the same position
you were in before we met, but now, somehow, it's my fault."
John Fields
2009-02-19 23:07:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Pointless. To insult someone they must know you are doing so.
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them.
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Like what?
---
Like to put them in their place, for one.
---
If I don't understand the insult, you haven't placed me anywhere.
---
Try to keep up, OK?

We're not talking about you and your disabilities, I was answering your
question about what insults can be used for.

Whether _you_ understand the insult is immaterial, since the fact
remains that an insult can be used to someone in their place.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing.
---
Sure I have.
What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
What use is that?
---
It's a weapon I can use against you in the future.
---
Admittance of trolling noted.
---
I don't _admit_ to trolling, asshole, I REVEL in it.

Especially when I hook minnows, like you, pretending to be sharks.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.
So why do you keep responding?
---
To prevent you getting the last wod and gloating about it.
---
So it's OK for you to have the last word, but not for me?
---
Of course.
---
Well, that's a juicy little tidbit. Got any more?
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
"Polly want a cracker?"
Trite, predictable, and ordinary.
Sorry, I've not enrolled in the troll school like yourself.
---
Bullshit.
You're just not that good at it and you hate it when you get caught
because you can't flame worth a shit either.
So you do admit to trolling.
---
"Admit" is such a pussy word, and now that you've taken the bait and
can't get off the hook, hatch gonna do?

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-20 20:30:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them.
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Like what?
---
Like to put them in their place, for one.
---
If I don't understand the insult, you haven't placed me anywhere.
---
Try to keep up, OK?
We're not talking about you and your disabilities, I was answering your
question about what insults can be used for.
Whether _you_ understand the insult is immaterial, since the fact
remains that an insult can be used to someone in their place.
---
If they don't understand the insult, you haven't put them in their place. Imagine insulting someone in another language.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing.
---
Sure I have.
What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
What use is that?
---
It's a weapon I can use against you in the future.
---
Admittance of trolling noted.
---
I don't _admit_ to trolling, asshole, I REVEL in it.
Especially when I hook minnows, like you, pretending to be sharks.
---
Trolls are the lowest form of life. Nobody looks up to you.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.
So why do you keep responding?
---
To prevent you getting the last wod and gloating about it.
---
So it's OK for you to have the last word, but not for me?
---
Of course.
---
Well, that's a juicy little tidbit. Got any more?
---
You sad git.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

If debugging is the process of removing software bugs, then programming must be the process of putting them in.
John Fields
2009-02-20 21:05:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them.
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Like what?
---
Like to put them in their place, for one.
---
If I don't understand the insult, you haven't placed me anywhere.
---
Try to keep up, OK?
We're not talking about you and your disabilities, I was answering your
question about what insults can be used for.
Whether _you_ understand the insult is immaterial, since the fact
remains that an insult can be used to someone in their place.
---
If they don't understand the insult, you haven't put them in their place. Imagine insulting someone in another language.
---
Damn, but you're thick! You still don't get it...
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing.
---
Sure I have.
What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
What use is that?
---
It's a weapon I can use against you in the future.
---
Admittance of trolling noted.
---
I don't _admit_ to trolling, asshole, I REVEL in it.
Especially when I hook minnows, like you, pretending to be sharks.
---
Trolls are the lowest form of life. Nobody looks up to you.
---
Are you kidding?

Trolling is a high art when it's done properly and when the intended
prey is well-hooked.

Like you, my boy, out there playing your little line-wrap and last word
games.

Well, the hook is firmly set and I'll not cut you loose anytime soon.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.
So why do you keep responding?
---
To prevent you getting the last wod and gloating about it.
---
So it's OK for you to have the last word, but not for me?
---
Of course.
---
Well, that's a juicy little tidbit. Got any more?
---
You sad git.
---
What's the matter, hook starting to bother you?

JF
The Hippy
2009-02-21 01:21:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
Nope.
When you've been insulted, you've been insulted whether you know it or
not.
Sometimes it's even sweeter if don't understand the insult because that
shows off your stupidity.
The point of insulting someone is to annoy them.
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Like what?
---
Like to put them in their place, for one.
---
If I don't understand the insult, you haven't placed me anywhere.
---
Try to keep up, OK?
We're not talking about you and your disabilities, I was answering your
question about what insults can be used for.
Whether _you_ understand the insult is immaterial, since the fact
remains that an insult can be used to someone in their place.
---
If they don't understand the insult, you haven't put them in their place. Imagine insulting someone in another language.
---
Damn, but you're thick! You still don't get it...
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
If they don't understand the insult, you've achieved nothing.
---
Sure I have.
What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
What use is that?
---
It's a weapon I can use against you in the future.
---
Admittance of trolling noted.
---
I don't _admit_ to trolling, asshole, I REVEL in it.
Especially when I hook minnows, like you, pretending to be sharks.
---
Trolls are the lowest form of life. Nobody looks up to you.
---
Are you kidding?
Trolling is a high art when it's done properly and when the intended
prey is well-hooked.
Like you, my boy, out there playing your little line-wrap and last word
games.
Well, the hook is firmly set and I'll not cut you loose anytime soon.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You might aswell wait until someone is out of earshot then call him names.
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.
So why do you keep responding?
---
To prevent you getting the last wod and gloating about it.
---
So it's OK for you to have the last word, but not for me?
---
Of course.
---
Well, that's a juicy little tidbit. Got any more?
---
You sad git.
---
What's the matter, hook starting to bother you?
JF
The only traffic in this group (comp.sci.elec) for the past few days has
been you two bitching at each other. Now. Whose gonna be the bigger man
and back down. Lets face it. Nobody heres a winner really are they ?
Peter Hucker
2009-02-21 19:16:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
So say you, but there are many more reasons than that to insult someone.
---
Like what?
---
Like to put them in their place, for one.
---
If I don't understand the insult, you haven't placed me anywhere.
---
Try to keep up, OK?
We're not talking about you and your disabilities, I was answering your
question about what insults can be used for.
Whether _you_ understand the insult is immaterial, since the fact
remains that an insult can be used to someone in their place.
---
If they don't understand the insult, you haven't put them in their place. Imagine insulting someone in another language.
---
Damn, but you're thick! You still don't get it...
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
Sure I have.
What I've achieved is discovering that your insight and intellectual
resources are insufficient to understand the insult and then to
retaliate.
---
What use is that?
---
It's a weapon I can use against you in the future.
---
Admittance of trolling noted.
---
I don't _admit_ to trolling, asshole, I REVEL in it.
Especially when I hook minnows, like you, pretending to be sharks.
---
Trolls are the lowest form of life. Nobody looks up to you.
---
Are you kidding?
Trolling is a high art when it's done properly and when the intended
prey is well-hooked.
Like you, my boy, out there playing your little line-wrap and last word
games.
Well, the hook is firmly set and I'll not cut you loose anytime soon.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
You keep responding, so you're well within earshot, and you obviously
feel you have an emotional investment in the thread, otherwise you'd
just drop it.
So why do you keep responding?
---
To prevent you getting the last wod and gloating about it.
---
So it's OK for you to have the last word, but not for me?
---
Of course.
---
Well, that's a juicy little tidbit. Got any more?
---
You sad git.
---
What's the matter, hook starting to bother you?
JF
You're a silly little child. I prefer discussions with intelligent adults.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Why doesn't DOS ever say "EXCELLENT command or filename"?
John Fields
2009-02-22 00:55:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
What's the matter, hook starting to bother you?
JF
You're a silly little child. I prefer discussions with intelligent adults.
---
As do I.

Unfortunately, I now have to deal with you.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-22 18:09:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
What's the matter, hook starting to bother you?
JF
You're a silly little child. I prefer discussions with intelligent adults.
---
As do I.
Unfortunately, I now have to deal with you.
JF
Trolls and intelligent adults are mutually exclusive.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

I used to not get along with my mother-in-law, but over the last few
months, I've developed quite an attachment for her. It goes over her
head, and a strap comes down under her chin to keep her mouth shut.
John Fields
2009-02-23 00:19:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
What's the matter, hook starting to bother you?
JF
You're a silly little child. I prefer discussions with intelligent adults.
---
As do I.
Unfortunately, I now have to deal with you.
JF
Trolls and intelligent adults are mutually exclusive.
---
Then you're obviously not be an intelligent adult.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-23 19:42:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
What's the matter, hook starting to bother you?
JF
You're a silly little child. I prefer discussions with intelligent adults.
---
As do I.
Unfortunately, I now have to deal with you.
JF
Trolls and intelligent adults are mutually exclusive.
---
Then you're obviously not be an intelligent adult.
JF
You have admitted you are a troll. You have also stated that I am no good at trolling. Therefore I am not one, and must be an intelligent adult.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

It turns out a Chinese food deliveryman who was thought to be missing, was actually stuck in a Manhattan apartment building elevator for 4 days.
The man is ok, but the building's owner is charging him $1,500 rent.
John Fields
2009-02-24 03:11:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
You have admitted you are a troll.
---
The term "admitted" is one _you_ introduced in a pejorative way and one
which I don't subscribe to for reasons I've stated before.
Post by Peter Hucker
You have also stated that I am no good at trolling.
---
Indeed.
---

Therefore I am not one, and must be an intelligent adult.

---
Wrong on both counts.

My saying you're not good at trolling doesn't mean you're not a troll,
it just means that you're a troll who's not good at trolling.

Not knowing the difference also means that you're not an intelligent
adult.

A good analogy might be that of a thief who gets caught a lot. He's not
an intelligent adult because he gets caught a lot, but he's still a
thief.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-24 19:56:25 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have admitted you are a troll.
---
The term "admitted" is one _you_ introduced in a pejorative way and one
which I don't subscribe to for reasons I've stated before.
WTF are you on about now? You said you were a troll and that's that. You were boasting about being a very good troll, or a better troll than me, or something like that.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have also stated that I am no good at trolling.
---
Indeed.
---
Therefore I am not one, and must be an intelligent adult.
---
Wrong on both counts.
My saying you're not good at trolling doesn't mean you're not a troll,
it just means that you're a troll who's not good at trolling.
Not knowing the difference also means that you're not an intelligent
adult.
A good analogy might be that of a thief who gets caught a lot. He's not
an intelligent adult because he gets caught a lot, but he's still a
thief.
But I'm not a troll at all.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Officer: Soldier, do you have change for a dollar?
Soldier: Sure, buddy.
Officer: That's no way to address an officer! Now let's try it again. Soldier, do you have change for a dollar?
Soldier: No, SIR!
John Fields
2009-02-24 20:39:09 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have admitted you are a troll.
---
The term "admitted" is one _you_ introduced in a pejorative way and one
which I don't subscribe to for reasons I've stated before.
WTF are you on about now? You said you were a troll and that's that.
---
Yes, I said I was a troll, which is way different than an admission.

An admission carries with it guilt, which is what you're trying to heap
on me.

It won't work, because there's nothing about you which carries authority
of any kind.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
You were boasting about being a very good troll,
or a better troll than me, or something like that.
---
I said nothing of the sort, as I recall.

What I did say was that I reveled in trolling for minnows pretending to
be sharks, and that's why you're on my hook.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have also stated that I am no good at trolling.
---
I said you weren't very good at it, not that you were no good at it.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
Indeed.
---
Therefore I am not one, and must be an intelligent adult.
---
Wrong on both counts.
My saying you're not good at trolling doesn't mean you're not a troll,
it just means that you're a troll who's not good at trolling.
Not knowing the difference also means that you're not an intelligent
adult.
A good analogy might be that of a thief who gets caught a lot. He's not
an intelligent adult because he gets caught a lot, but he's still a
thief.
But I'm not a troll at all.
---
Yes, you are.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-24 20:44:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have admitted you are a troll.
---
The term "admitted" is one _you_ introduced in a pejorative way and one
which I don't subscribe to for reasons I've stated before.
WTF are you on about now? You said you were a troll and that's that.
---
Yes, I said I was a troll, which is way different than an admission.
An admission carries with it guilt, which is what you're trying to heap
on me.
It won't work, because there's nothing about you which carries authority
of any kind.
You're now quibbling about pedantic meanings of words. When I say "you admit to it", I mean you agree that you are that thing.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You were boasting about being a very good troll,
or a better troll than me, or something like that.
---
I said nothing of the sort, as I recall.
What I did say was that I reveled in trolling for minnows pretending to
be sharks, and that's why you're on my hook.
That's near enough.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have also stated that I am no good at trolling.
---
I said you weren't very good at it, not that you were no good at it.
Stop trying to chat me up. I have enough problems with a homosexual in the survival group.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
---
Indeed.
---
Therefore I am not one, and must be an intelligent adult.
---
Wrong on both counts.
My saying you're not good at trolling doesn't mean you're not a troll,
it just means that you're a troll who's not good at trolling.
Not knowing the difference also means that you're not an intelligent
adult.
A good analogy might be that of a thief who gets caught a lot. He's not
an intelligent adult because he gets caught a lot, but he's still a
thief.
But I'm not a troll at all.
---
Yes, you are.
No. I define a troll as someone who starts arguments for the sake of it, just to wind people up, or to get the most replies to his posts. I just reply to people for conversation, or when I disagree with a point they've made.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

A waiter brings the customer the steak he ordered with his thumb over the meat.
"Are you crazy?" yelled the customer, "with your hand on my steak?"
"What" answers the waiter, "You want it to fall on the floor again?"
John Fields
2009-02-25 01:12:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have admitted you are a troll.
---
The term "admitted" is one _you_ introduced in a pejorative way and one
which I don't subscribe to for reasons I've stated before.
WTF are you on about now? You said you were a troll and that's that.
---
Yes, I said I was a troll, which is way different than an admission.
An admission carries with it guilt, which is what you're trying to heap
on me.
It won't work, because there's nothing about you which carries authority
of any kind.
You're now quibbling about pedantic meanings of words. When I say "you admit to it", I mean you agree that you are that thing.
---
It's not 'pedantic' it's 'semantic', and if you don't know the
difference between the two perhaps I gave you too much credit for
knowing anything about the emotional baggage one agrees to take on when
one 'admits' to an accusation made by another.

And, BTW, your refusal to CR LF for your readers' convenience is a sure
sign of a troll at work.

A low-grade troll who only wants to annoy and bring attention to himself
by making his readers pay to read his drivel, but a troll nonetheless.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You were boasting about being a very good troll,
or a better troll than me, or something like that.
---
I said nothing of the sort, as I recall.
What I did say was that I reveled in trolling for minnows pretending to
be sharks, and that's why you're on my hook.
That's near enough.
---
So, you admit to being hooked?
---
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have also stated that I am no good at trolling.
---
I said you weren't very good at it, not that you were no good at it.
Stop trying to chat me up.
---
Stop flattering yourself...

Since you think that you're the one who's in control, all you have to do
to make the whole thing go away is stop replying.
---
Post by Peter Hucker
I have enough problems with a homosexual in the survival group.
---
A woman who isn't interested in you?

A man who is?

Eewww...

Why are you in a group like that?
---
.
.
.
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
But I'm not a troll at all.
---
Yes, you are.
No. I define a troll as someone who starts arguments for the sake of it, just to wind people up, or to get the most replies to his posts. I just reply to people for conversation, or when I disagree with a point they've made.
---
Oh, how wonderfully benign...

You get to define it all away and wind up, according to you, _just
perfect_.

How about your refusal to CR LF on your end when you've been apprised
that your infinitely long line length is annoying?

Surely you're not stupid enough to think that doesn't wind people up
when you tell them that even though you know how to fix the problem you
won't, and it's their problem if they want to read you.

Or, maybe you are.

JF
Peter Hucker
2009-02-26 20:04:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have admitted you are a troll.
---
The term "admitted" is one _you_ introduced in a pejorative way and one
which I don't subscribe to for reasons I've stated before.
WTF are you on about now? You said you were a troll and that's that.
---
Yes, I said I was a troll, which is way different than an admission.
An admission carries with it guilt, which is what you're trying to heap
on me.
It won't work, because there's nothing about you which carries authority
of any kind.
You're now quibbling about pedantic meanings of words. When I say "you admit to it", I mean you agree that you are that thing.
---
It's not 'pedantic' it's 'semantic', and if you don't know the
difference between the two perhaps I gave you too much credit for
knowing anything about the emotional baggage one agrees to take on when
one 'admits' to an accusation made by another.
You're being pedantic again.
Post by John Fields
And, BTW, your refusal to CR LF for your readers' convenience is a sure
sign of a troll at work.
No it's lazyness, impoliteness, and perhaps a superiority complex.
Post by John Fields
A low-grade troll who only wants to annoy and bring attention to himself
by making his readers pay to read his drivel, but a troll nonetheless.
---
I don't care how much attention I get, I just have conversations.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You were boasting about being a very good troll,
or a better troll than me, or something like that.
---
I said nothing of the sort, as I recall.
What I did say was that I reveled in trolling for minnows pretending to
be sharks, and that's why you're on my hook.
That's near enough.
---
So, you admit to being hooked?
---
No.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
You have also stated that I am no good at trolling.
---
I said you weren't very good at it, not that you were no good at it.
Stop trying to chat me up.
---
Stop flattering yourself...
Since you think that you're the one who's in control, all you have to do
to make the whole thing go away is stop replying.
---
I don't want it to go away.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
I have enough problems with a homosexual in the survival group.
---
A woman who isn't interested in you?
x.
Post by John Fields
A man who is?
tick.
Post by John Fields
Eewww...
a grebe.
Post by John Fields
Why are you in a group like that?
Crosspost.
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
But I'm not a troll at all.
---
Yes, you are.
No. I define a troll as someone who starts arguments for the sake of it, just to wind people up, or to get the most replies to his posts. I just reply to people for conversation, or when I disagree with a point they've made.
---
Oh, how wonderfully benign...
You get to define it all away and wind up, according to you, _just
perfect_.
How about your refusal to CR LF on your end when you've been apprised
that your infinitely long line length is annoying?
Surely you're not stupid enough to think that doesn't wind people up
when you tell them that even though you know how to fix the problem you
won't, and it's their problem if they want to read you.
Or, maybe you are.
It isn't a problem if people have decent software.
--
http://www.petersparrots.com http://www.insanevideoclips.com http://www.petersphotos.com

Lawyers should never ask a Southern grandma a question if they aren't prepared for the answer.
In a trial, a Southern small-town prosecuting attorney called his first witness, a grand motherly, elderly woman to the stand.
He approached her and asked, "Mrs. Jones, do you know me?"
She responded, "Why, yes, I do know you, Mr. Williams.
I've known you since you were a young boy, and frankly, you've been a big disappointment to me.
You lie, you cheat on your wife, and you manipulate people and talk about them behind their backs.
You think you're a big shot when you haven't the brains to realize you never will amount to anything more than a two-bit paper pusher Yes, I know you."
The lawyer was stunned!
Not knowing what else to do, he pointed across the room and asked, "Mrs. Jones, do you know the defence attorney?"
She again replied, "Why, yes, I do. I've known Mr. Bradley since he was a youngster, too.
He's lazy, bigoted, and he has a drinking problem.
He can't build a normal relationship with anyone and his law practice is one of the worst in the entire state.
Not to mention he cheated on his wife with three different women.
One of them was your wife. Yes, I know him."
The defense attorney almost died.
The judge asked both counselors to approach the bench and, in a very quiet voice, said, "If either of you idiots asks her if she knows me, I'll send you to the electric chair."
Dave J.
2009-02-25 01:35:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
No. I define a troll as someone who starts arguments for the sake of it,
just to wind people up, or to get the most replies to his posts.
No no, that sounds more like a 'September-ite' AKA an AOLer.

A troll (a real one, the ones that are fun to watch from a distance) is
the one who'll make *one* posting, and then retire to watch a thirty plus
posting flame-roast-thread comprised of the ensuing argument between the
*other* subscribers.

One distinguishing factor between a truly skilled troll and a beginner is
whether initial cross posting is necessary to fan the flames.

Sadly they've become an endangered species these days. Pretty much
displaced by gangs of cross-posting childish vandals (usenet equiv of
hooded chavs) who see a cascade as a mark of artistry.


//---------------------

OB-Sci: Anyone know a UK source of tunnel diodes?

OB-Sci2: What's the current state of the single chip u-proc game? Low cost
devices, as self contained as possible, PC design tools would be nice
(compilers/assemblers/simulators). No particular target, some sort of
EEProm, reasonable chunk of en-chip RAM, any sort of IO. RISC or CISC
instruction set, not fussed. Something to play with. Preferably neither a
PIC nor a 'basic stamp'..

//----------------------


Dave J.
John Fields
2009-02-25 01:55:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dave J.
Post by Peter Hucker
No. I define a troll as someone who starts arguments for the sake of it,
just to wind people up, or to get the most replies to his posts.
No no, that sounds more like a 'September-ite' AKA an AOLer.
A troll (a real one, the ones that are fun to watch from a distance) is
the one who'll make *one* posting, and then retire to watch a thirty plus
posting flame-roast-thread comprised of the ensuing argument between the
*other* subscribers.
One distinguishing factor between a truly skilled troll and a beginner is
whether initial cross posting is necessary to fan the flames.
Sadly they've become an endangered species these days. Pretty much
displaced by gangs of cross-posting childish vandals (usenet equiv of
hooded chavs) who see a cascade as a mark of artistry.
---
Nice. :-)


JF
PCPaul
2009-02-26 20:53:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dave J.
OB-Sci2: What's the current state of the single chip u-proc game? Low
cost devices, as self contained as possible, PC design tools would be
nice (compilers/assemblers/simulators). No particular target, some sort
of EEProm, reasonable chunk of en-chip RAM, any sort of IO. RISC or CISC
instruction set, not fussed. Something to play with. Preferably neither
a PIC nor a 'basic stamp'..
The Arduino family seems to be gaining ground as playthings - based on
the Atmega uControllers.

There's a whole IDE, libraries etc for the asking, and a kit can be had
for £15 or so from the US via EBay.
Dave J.
2009-05-03 00:36:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by PCPaul
Post by Dave J.
OB-Sci2: What's the current state of the single chip u-proc game? Low
cost devices, as self contained as possible, PC design tools would be
nice (compilers/assemblers/simulators). No particular target, some sort
of EEProm, reasonable chunk of en-chip RAM, any sort of IO. RISC or CISC
instruction set, not fussed. Something to play with. Preferably neither
a PIC nor a 'basic stamp'..
The Arduino family seems to be gaining ground as playthings - based on
the Atmega uControllers.
There's a whole IDE, libraries etc for the asking, and a kit can be had
for £15 or so from the US via EBay.
Hey, thanks for that, a slightly more focused search on the subject has
brought back loads of interesting sample projects.

Loads to read about and scheme over. I haven't yet managed to find a write
up on straight ASM programming, all they seem to push is some sort of
compiled magicery. Also, shame it's so tiny on the RAM / eeprom front in
these days of gigabytes for tenners. For the price it's a marvelous
shortcut, including additional bells/whistles over what I'd consider
standard for a single chip proc. Just, like I say, puzzlement that it
doesn't seem to have caught up with what should be possible in this
decade.

Thanks again

PS: I completely missed this msg initially because the 'clever' crosspost
checking on this client decided I must have read it already.

Dave J.

Peter Hucker
2009-02-02 21:18:21 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Fields
Post by Peter Hucker
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill
since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in
particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to
it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I
can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10
cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal
aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were
absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and
now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving
her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets.
PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now
they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a
signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with
wireless networking?
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If its PIR it shouln't.
PIR is Passive Infra Red, and it's body heat which triggers the sensor,
not anthing the device transmits.
http://www.glolab.com./pirparts/pirmanual.PDF
I'm not sure if it's PIR or not. Aren't a lot of them nowadays multifunction?
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Dunno; you were the one who tagged it as PIR.
Force of habit, as that's all they used to be.
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Bob Larter
2009-03-30 06:44:16 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Hucker
We have a wireless network at work which appears to have gone downhill since the workmen installed PIRs for the burglar alarm. One of them in particular appears to cause dropped packets the closer a laptop is to it. Is this possible?? It's not a wireless PIR as far as I know, as I can see some leftover cable he was using which is a multicore (about 10 cores) type similar to phone systems, so I assume this is for the signal aswell as power. The person in that office swears blind that there were absolutely no problems until the PIR was installed above her desk, and now when I check, about 60% of the packets are being dropped. Moving her laptop to the opposite side of the room it drops only 5% of packets. PIRs used to just pick up infrared of your bodyheat, but I think now they are also motion sensors? Perhaps this means they are sending out a signal and bouncing it off you? Perhaps this could interfere with wireless networking?
The IR sensor might be one of the dual sensor (expensive!) type that
also include a microwave T/R motion sensing circuit. That would be very
likely to interfere with wireless networking systems. The security
company should be able to tell you for sure.
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. | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
\|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
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